Yes or No – P90 Personal Defense Weapon Review (PDW) – Battlefield 4 (BF4)

Hi YouTube, Darth Here: This is Yes or No, a weapon review series
where I give a clear and concise answer as to what weapons you should be using in Battlefield. Today’s weapon is the P90 Personal Defense
Weapon, which is one of the three weapons rewarded by completing the Battlefield 4 single
player campaign. The P90 has some distinct characteristics
that make it a hip-fire machine, and can cause some havoc in bursts. But should you be using the P90, Yes or No? No. Although it’s close to being a recommendation,
there are several things that hold back the P90 — and it has something to do with the
way Battlefield 4 processes rate of fire. Let’s talk about the gun’s above-ground
characteristics that make it an attractive weapon. The P90 has a rate of fire of 900 rounds-per-minute,
making it relatively forgiving of missed shots. The rate-of-fire also helps to buoy it’s
lackluster damage model so that the P90 is inside the average for damage of PDWs. Even if you don’t land every shot, the P90
can give a lot of punishment in a short time given the right ranges. The P90 has possibly one of the best hip-fire
pairings in the game. It’s in the PDW class, which already affords
it some benefit, and it’s a bullpup. The on-the-move and standing hipfire advantages
certainly make the P90 look attractive to CQB players. When paired with a laser sight, it’s extremely
unlikely that you’ll miss a lot of hip-fire shots closer than 15 meters. With 50 rounds per magazine, the P90 is tied
with the CBJ-MS for the largest amount of ammo in a PDW magazine. Only the light machine guns carry more in
Battlefield 4. The benefit is that you can go long periods
between reloads and potentially hold off a larger number of enemies. At .3 degrees left and .3 degrees right per
shot, the P90 has a balanced recoil that makes it easier to use. In general the recoil pattern is going to
go up like a V. This makes it easier to predict, and likely
a good deal more attractive for console players as counteracting the horizontal recoil is
not required. So there’s a lot of advantages to running
the P90 if you’re so inclined. Tons of ammo, forgiving recoil, and good at
hip-fire. The P90 is a relatively decent weapon if you’re
new to the game and don’t mind the shortcomings of the weapon. Which I shall talk about now. At 2.9 seconds for the short reload, and 3.55
seconds for the long, the P90 has some long reload times. It’s the second worst in the PDW category
behind the Groza. Especially for a close quarters weapon, I
find that long reloads are pretty bad due to the nature of CQB. Because you’re in the enemy’s face, suddenly
dropping a long reload time can often mean your next target is rounding the corner and
you’re out of luck. At just 21 max damage per shot, for body shots
you start at five-bullets-to-kill, and it drops off to 6 bullets to kill by just 16
meters. I often remarked that I was tickling my enemies
whenever I turned the P90 on them. I imagine they probably were pretty tickled
that the outcome was usually they win at any range beyond my arm’s reach. With a first shot recoil multiplier of 2x,
the P90 crosses over into the territory of having a high first shot recoil multiplier. This means that its upwards recoil is doubled
every time you first start shooting — specifically after that first bullet. This makes its aimed potential even more bothersome
and pretty much means shots beyond close quarters are a coinflip or worse. On paper, the P90 seemed like it was going
to be a pretty good weapon. I gave the MP7 a Yes-vote some time ago and
the P90 is not that far off in characteristics — in fact it’s better at hip-fire. So I really had to do some research to figure
out why I felt like I was cursed anytime I was using the P90. PDWs are somewhat limiting, but this one felt
especially out-of-place versus its on-paper stats. Let’s check out some of the numbers behind
this weapon for some insight. Against a spread of the MP7, the JS2, and
the SG553, the P90 doesn’t look too bad. Using aimed fire, the MP7 has a very small
advantage out to 15 or so meters. This wasn’t quite as big a difference as
I had hoped, because my experience with the guns was significantly wider than this millisecond
spread implied. So I looked a little bit deeper. Next I took a look at the hip-fire performance
of the weapons versus their time-to-kill. Here, the MP7 wins but it’s not by as wide
of a margin as I would have expected. Now the MP7 does have some advantages, like
coming with a folding grip — but that’s not a vast enough difference to explain why
I didn’t like the P90 nearly as much. This was weird to me, so I had to take into
account something I don’t usually do on this series. A technicality of the Frostbite engine that
is a bit strange and usually doesn’t matter enough to make a difference. What it comes down to is how Battlefield 4
handles rate-of-fire and the individual frames of the game. This research was gathered by Symthic user
3VertsNorth. Weapons that are 800-900 rounds-per-minute
are essentially the same in the first five bullets. They release five bullets in nine frames. This matters because most weapons are five
bullets to kill in close-to-mid range. The MP7 at 950 rounds-per-minute will release
those five bullets in eight frames — giving it a distinct advantage in time-to-kill in
close quarters versus the other weapons. I’ve tried to illustrate this as best as
possible using a modified rate-of-fire to compensate for this fact. What this comes down to is that rate-of-fire
on weapons matters a little bit less than you might have thought. Generally it’s a good measure of a weapon’s
performance, but with the P90 it really becomes necessary to show the distinction between
why this weapon is lackluster and the MP7 really sings. Also keep in mind that PDWs share an envelope
with shotguns, so you need to have reasons to not just run the insta-kill weapon. Being one of the campaign weapons, the P90
requires you to play through the entire campaign and make a very particular choice at the end. You have to choose to give the C4 to Hannah
when the campaign demands you make the choice at the end of the final single player level. It’s not a particularly difficult mission
and the last half is mostly cinematic. You can replay the mission and simply make
a different choice to unlock the different weapons. Honestly, all three of the weapons unlocked
from the campaign are relatively lackluster outside of console. So if you’ve not gathered them by now I
do not recommend doing this unless you’re a completionist. The recoil of the P90 is another one that’s
relatively forgiving. It’s just .32 degrees up, .3 left, and .3
right, with a first shot recoil multiplier of 2.0. This means that the weapon is going to go
up and form a roughly v-like shape. The aimed fire of this weapon is pretty atrocious,
so I would much more recommend using hipfire at all times. To counter the recoil, you’ll merely need
to pull straight down. I don’t recommend trying to hose your targets
even with hip-fire. As you can see, the spread-per-shot can make
this weapon relatively unwieldy in short order. The minimum hip-fire spread is .75 degrees
on the first shot and it gets worse pretty fast with the 900 rounds-per-minute rate of
fire. Instead, try to get in close, and use bursting
with your hip-fire. You’ll want to aim for bursts of about 5
rounds, as out to fifteen meters that will get the job done pretty quick. Micro Bursting is probably out as the first
shot recoil multiplier is in the territory where I wouldn’t recommend it. And unlike the MPX you can’t choose to pair
the P90 with an angled grip. The P90 is only good in close quarters, and
we’re talking really close — closer than 16 meters as the game would have it. That means you’re going to need to find
ways to get creative on bigger maps, play smaller maps, or simply stick to close quarters
areas on big maps. I tend to run smoke grenades with short range
weapons, as this lets me screen some movement when I otherwise have no hope. And really, the P90 is pathetic even at mid-range
so you’re not scaring anybody. As PDWs are engineer-exclusive in Battlefield
4, I recommend running with the SMAW. This will let you reach out and hit long-range
targets with some rocket-powered justice. You can also bring a long-range performance
sidearm like the Magnum, but I really didn’t find myself using that too terribly much against
long range targets. Ultimately, where the P90 is going to suit
you best is going to be in the close quarters game. Be sure you’re always hip-firing the weapon
and pushing your advantage. If you’re not full on health, you’ll probably
want to hang back for a bit for a regen. Because the damage output of the P90 is not
that great, you’re going to be risking it if you expect to kill your target with a health
disadvantage. If they pull on you the same time you do them,
you’re going to lose as you do not have a time-to-kill advantage — even with your
hipfire advantage. So pick your battles appropriately. Being a PDW, the P90 has a distinct disadvantage
in that you don’t get to choose a whole lot of options for the gun. It’s a bullpup, so it has some advantage
built-in for the on-the-move and hipfire abilities, and that’s really where you should be thinking
about tuning it up a little bit. Doing the typical cross-reference with
and Battlelog, I found that most top players tend to do a few things. For the most part, they ran the RDS sights,
no accessory, and a heavy barrel. That’s a relatively good setup, and that’s
a decent starting spot. But what did I end up running for the P90? For my optic, I mostly used the Coyote red
dot sight. I honestly don’t think you should be using
your sight too much, and I sometimes considered throwing something awful on it just to discourage
using the sight. But the Coyote is built for close quarters
combat and I think it’s just a little less distracting than the other options. You’re certainly free to pick whatever you
want here, but just know that higher magnification sights are going to be painful because of
the high first shot recoil on the P90. For the accessory, I ended up using the laser
sight. Now, this gives the weapon a bit better of
a hip-fire bonus, but I think if you’re paranoid you might want to ditch the laser
sight. Lasers have the problem in Battlefield 4 of
being giveaways, and not just in line of sight either. The dot they project goes through everything,
so running around can sometimes give you away before you ever draw on an opponent. If you feel like you’re paranoid, you could
certainly get rid of the laser and be fine enough in close quarters. The laser isn’t going to win you too many
more encounters than its going to prematurely give away. At least on the P90. Finally, for my barrel I mostly ran with the
Suppressor. It’ll slow the performance of the P90 down
somewhat, taking the actually decent velocity from 460 meters-per-second to just 320. But it gives you the distinct advantage of
having longer runs before you get stopped. Remember how I said earlier that the P90 has
bad damage and doesn’t win if you’re at a health disadvantage? Well the easiest way to get into that situation
is to find yourself in a group of enemies with an unsilenced weapon. Throw a silencer on it and you can get a killstreak
going a lot more easily, without having to worry about being at a constant disadvantage
from enemies that are hunting you. So the P90 is a weapon that is on the verge
of greatness. I think on the consoles it probably would
be a Yes-vote thanks to its balanced recoil and relative forgiveness of missed shots. But due to some technicalities, and a general
lack of performance in Battlefield 4’s golden ranges of 15-35 meters, I find it hard for
the P90 to carve itself a good spot. Short of a large ammo capacity, it doesn’t
really outperform its peers in the PDW category and certainly struggles against shotguns. Given all of this, it’s a No — but just
barely. Since I talked it up a bunch in this episode,
if you’re looking for an alternative I still do recommend the MP7. It’s almost as good at hipfire and has a
distinct time-to-kill advantage over the P90. The reload time is faster as well, at just
2.65 seconds, and it only carries 10 fewer bullets per magazine than the P90. It’s definitely my favorite close-quarters
PDW thus far. If you’re looking for close quarters punching
power, and don’t care about being quiet, you can’t go wrong with the Saiga 12K. This magazine-fed shotgun is exceptionally
powerful in the short game and doesn’t sacrifice killing potential for its ammunition load. It’ll never be as great at hip-fire, but
that doesn’t much matter when the shotgun will often kill in a single shot. That’s it for this episode of Yes or No. If there’s something you think I missed,
or if you have a particularly different take on the P90, please let me know in the comments
below. If you’ve got a weapon you’d like me to
review for Battlefield, also leave a comment. If you like what you saw, be sure to force
choke that like button. If you’re new here, check out my channel
and consider sticking around with a subscribe. And as always, thanks for watching, and I’ll
see you next time YouTube.

100 thoughts on “Yes or No – P90 Personal Defense Weapon Review (PDW) – Battlefield 4 (BF4)

  1. MP-7 is a huge YES. That gun has some incredibly narrow ADS spread. It can get you a lot of occasional mid range kills if you’re like me and really struggle to hold your fire when needed.
    I’d say hip fire automatics in BF4 are for the most part useless. You Darth consider P90 lacking but I can tell you PDWR is way worse.

  2. Played the last campaign mission three times for all weapons. One Chinese assault rifle that not great, one lmg that amazing (if use correctly) and this thing. Let say it was not worth it.

  3. Lolz, you probably had a bad time cause you hipfire too much. I dunno what it is but personally i really love PDW's. 2nd for total killz with PDW's in Australia 🙂 MX4 next please.

  4. I really love the content man, I still love bf4 to this day so its great to see someone like you carry on making bf4 content even when its soon to be the 4th newest bf game. Keep it up I hope more success comes your way because you deserve it! 😊

  5. Love that you still make bf4 videos. also your opinions tend to be different than level cap and matimio. good stuff keep it up

  6. I remember absolutely destroying ppl with this in BF3 CQB maps, but it just didn't get the job done in 4. I'd run it with a suppressor and laser. Speaking of which, why are you calling it a "sight" at 9:03?

  7. Why are you making BF4 videos in 2018? Why am I watching BF4 videos in 2018? I don't think DICE has the answer for that. I sure don't.

  8. I dunno what pdw to use cos I've only unlocked about half of them and I couldn't be arsed ranking them up when I have the assault class maxed out

    Any suggestions on the best early pdw?

  9. I feel like BF4 will make a comeback. After BF1 and soon BFV, there's a high chance that this game will maintain a stable population for a long time. Like Hardline flopped and we got some free DLC. Why I am saying this is because BF4 should return as a mainstream game; on par with say TF2, lasting since 2007. The game will last for a long time, so if DICE would jump on this livelihood it gives it would be a profit machine in all honesty (That's the only incentive for them to come back). Plus, this game has videos being made about it still (cough Darth cough). So hopefully we can get a return of BF4, which is what I hope.

    Sorry for the wall text.

  10. The problem with doing the campaign to unlock weapons is the fact that it's broken. At least for premium users on PC. I tried replaying for the heck of it and couldnt even get the elevator to move on the first level

  11. Swear to god, already have my lovely MP7 and now I’m going play through the entire campaign to unlock these guns, knowing full well one of them sucks. Hopefully I never get around to it.

  12. Thanks for covering the p90! I requested this one a few weeks ago, good gun and fun to use but due to low dmg there are superior choices as engineer.👍

  13. Mind you these frame rules for 900 and 800rpm weapons are only a thing on 30Hz, so for consoles this does hold true (at least on CQ). On 60Hz servers the 900rpm becomes useful. Not to mention that even on 30Hz, you are bound to miss a round, and with 900rpm you're gonna be on track to a good TTK somewhat faster vs 800rpm (because you are not gonna get all your shots on target in the first 5 rounds most of the time). So counting that as a massive downside is overstating the effect of something that only really becomes applicable with raw TTK numbers (that are never accurate anyway).

    I think I'm gonna have to disagree with this review. The P90 is a pretty decent gun that trades blows with the MP7 most of the time, making it a viable choice.

  14. Groza 1 or 4 please. I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised by their performance, despite some of their glaring stats.

  15. Hey Darth, do you think we should have in build in squad voice chat and proximity chat in Battlefield to make it a bit more serious? I feel like the squad system right now is just for the spawn points (hopefully bfv is changing that) and the gameplay is leaning towards cod more and more

  16. P90 is very similar to PP-19 in BF3, pea-shooter damage, high ROF and high magazine capacity. It used to be better before the damage is lowered, and its better than JS2 after its magazine capacity is lower to 30. I really hope Recon can use PDWs too, P90 would be nice if you have motion sensors or T-UGs.

    It's very difficult to use P90 against most other players using assault rifles. Like I said before, PDWs are not doing so hot even in their intended distances. The way works for me best is use the suppressor and laser, maybe coyote but aimed fire and stand-up fight is not the strength of P90. Just like PP-19, I prefer the stealth route when using P90, stay mobile and keep quiet, operate behind enemy lines and you might kill half of the enemy team if you are lucky enough. I got my P90 dogtag fairly quickly (Getting about 40 to 50 kills per round) because it does okay in Locker, I can't imagine how P90 would fare when used in big open maps though.

    I am not a big fan of MP7, its good but doesn't feel right in my hands. I would like CZ3-A1 SR-2, AS Val or MPX instead. I would still give P90 a "yes", because there are many crappier options out there.

  17. Anyone who tells you what you should/should not be using is simplistic, naive and a complete hack who has no idea what they're talking about. Every weapon has its strengths and weaknesses. Plus, weapons that shine in certain situations suck in others, on top which, and most important, different players have vastly differing play styles which means an average weapon in one players hands could very well be beastly in another player's. Gtfo with this 'yes or no' crap, it's just NOT that simple…and it's narcissistic and arrogant to assume that everyone plays like you do. Players, try out weapons for yourself – you could be pleasantly surprised.

  18. Just found your channel, and am wondering how you haven't gained hundreds of thousands of subs by now! Great, unique content, regular uploads, good voice, fantastic editing and gameplay…
    Youtube can be a mystery sometimes, eh?

  19. The P90 is easy to use and forgiving, which is why many players, old and new, used it. I used to use the P90 but after I unlocked the AS VAL I don't use the P90 that often. AS VAL just destroys people in close range.

  20. Here watching BF4 gun videos by Darth because EA/Dice let me down. Since I'm going to play BF4 for a couple more years, can we rent some servers that have all 30 maps available to play?

  21. Big fan of your Yes or No series, great advice, and as much as a Gun review can be … I find them entertaining.
    There is one that I would be interested in seeing and knowing your opinion on. The ACE21CQB, personally I think it's one of the unsung hero's in the game. The ACE21CQB gets so little love. On wide open Maps like Golmud Railway when playing Engineer with ammo crates and Support guys few and far between those extra rounds come in handy.

    Another one that might be interesting would be the MG4. In this vid you seem to imply a NO for the M249. Given the similarity of these weapons it would be interesting to see a Yes or No on either of the .556 LMGs.

  22. Hey Darth, could you do a review on the PDW R next? Been using it for hip fire play recently and… my god, this thing is a damn beast!

  23. Speaking of campaign weapons, could you please do a review of the QBZ-95-1? People rarely use it and there are almost no videos on youtube reviewing it since the last weapon update (or even before). It'd be nice to get your opinion on one of the forgotten weapons that nobody bothers with because of the campaign requirement.

  24. Eh, despite the "No" recommendation I'm still going to use it.

    It still works really well with a suppressor, is a bullpup PDW, has a high rate of fire, and has a BIG mag. This is the perfect gun to use when you are in Conquest trying to take out tanks. When you have to take out infantry you don't show up on the tank's minimap, the big mag allows you to take more shots at a ranged target (surprisingly effective), it is a hipfire machine for CQB, and the big mag also gives you enough ammo to last a while when you have a long life during Conquest.

    If it goes toe to toe with an AEK or ACW-R, yeah it'll lose. But it's kinda the Ace 23 of PDW's – average all around.

  25. It’s better for Rush game modes than conquest. It’s limiting factors are not as prevalent with smaller player counts and more CQB linear maps. Gotta have a suppressor though because if your not sneaky it’s low damage can really hurt you.

  26. Hmm… Could you do a shotgun? Unless theres only 1 good shotgun… Then maybe carry this series on to bf1 or bfv?

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